Posted by: BHL (Knight1285@aol.com) on Mon Feb 16 23:43:11 2004

>>> Sorry for being long-winded. The answers to all of your questions is yes, and the angle I advocate is 25-30 degrees, as you suggested. One more point: Mike believes in "soft elbows," but I am the one who recommends the 25-30 degree angle remaining between the forearm and biceps of both arms during the swing. <<<
>
> Hi BHL
>
> Thanks for your straightforward answer. -- Mike asks a question that I have always wished I had originated. The question is, “Do we actually teach what we see?” In other words, are the mechanics we advocate as being productive found in the swings of the games best hitters.
>
> Before I posted my question to you, I went to http://www.youthbaseballcoaching.com/swings.html and studied the lead-arm of those great hitters. BHL, I could not find one whose lead-elbow angle was less the 120 degrees or so at contact. Most were 145 to 175 degrees approaching contact. If you can find even one of those hitters whose elbow remains anywhere close to 25 or 30 degrees during the swing, please point it out to me.
>
> Jack Mankin
>
> Dear Jack,

You might be right on this one, when one applies it literally. The reason I use the elbows this way in the fence drill is so that hitters can "feel" the effect of a tight, circular path. However, if this "cue" allows a person to attain "results," and correct a problem via overcompensation, does it really matter what "cue" a person uses to attain the proper biomechanical results. I believe this is what Mad Max (on Paul Nyman's site) is referring to when he discusses cues vs. reality. I am not a Setpro regular, but did read that article.

As a sidebar, if you want to know where my cues for hip rotation were derived, visit the 12th page of the Mike Epstein forum. Scroll down approximately 20 topics (many containing their own threads), until you find a subject posted by John Abreu (on Mar-14-02) called "Stance." Under the head topic listic, scroll down about five threads to Mike's response on "Stance" (on Jun-12-02), where he responds to a poster named Greggie. Read the brief instruction Mike gives to a coach who needs to use his backside proactively because the hips do not turn when the front heel drops. Then, tell me why you think these cues are "bad." Perhaps you will discover that rotating the heel--rotating the bat head works for some individuals in rotating around a stationary axis, but Mike's "cues" are also valid.

I am interested in your feedback!

Sincerely,
BHL
Knight1285@aol.com