Bat Speed -- Baseball Hitting Forum

Posted by: Jack Mankin (MrBatspeed@aol.com) on Sun Jan 9 12:12:26 2011

>>> I have a question about the handle torque. I know it's a push-pull action of the hands. however I see most hitters having their hands not actually moving in comparison to the shoulders. the top hand is not actually pulled back it stays at the same distance in relation to the back shoulder.

but still there are torquing forces on the handle.

could it be that the rotation of the shoulders and elbows create that torque without the hands moving independently? because I don't see a lot of independent hand movement the swing seems to be "connected" to the back shoulder.

there are also theories out that the torque comes from rotation of the forearms around it's axis. the top hand supinates at initiation which causes the barrel to be turned to the catcher without the hand acutally moving back in comparison to the shoulder. so the flattening of the hands is the torque.

which one is correct? <<<

Hi Dominik

Your post raises some good questions but also shows we have made progress these past ten years. At least now more coaches are acknowledging the existence of handle torque. -- You state, "I know it's a push-pull action of the hands. however I see most hitters having their hands not actually moving in comparison to the shoulders."

Applying torque ("push-pull action") causes the bat to rotate about a point - the push/pull action should 'not' accelerate the point of rotation. Therefore, when the batter applies torque to rotate the bat-head about a point between the hands, the hand (as a unit) should remain back in relationship to the back-shoulder and allow the rotation of the shoulders to advance the hands to the contact zone.

In the torque demonstration below, note that although the bath-head accelerates, the point of bat rotation in relationship to my body remains constant. The push/pull action causes the hands to rotate about a point, but for the hands (as a unit) to move forward, I would rotate my body. The same is true when applying THT.

Demo - Torque applied at the handle

I will cover your other questions in following posts on this thread.

Jack Mankin

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> >>> I have a question about the handle torque. I know it's a push-pull action of the hands. however I see most hitters having their hands not actually moving in comparison to the shoulders. the top hand is not actually pulled back it stays at the same distance in relation to the back shoulder.
> 
> but still there are torquing forces on the handle.
> 
> could it be that the rotation of the shoulders and elbows create that torque without the hands moving independently? because I don't see a lot of independent hand movement the swing seems to be "connected" to the back shoulder.
> 
> there are also theories out that the torque comes from rotation of the forearms around it's axis. the top hand supinates at initiation which causes the barrel to be turned to the catcher without the hand acutally moving back in comparison to the shoulder. so the flattening of the hands is the torque.
> 
> which one is correct? <<<
> 
> Hi Dominik
> 
> Your post raises some good questions but also shows we have made progress these past ten years. At least now more coaches are acknowledging the existence of handle torque. -- You state,  "I know it's a push-pull action of the hands. however I see most hitters having their hands not actually moving in comparison to the shoulders." 
> 
> Applying torque ("push-pull action") causes the bat to rotate about a point - the push/pull action should 'not' accelerate the point of rotation. Therefore, when the batter applies torque to rotate the bat-head about a point between the hands, the hand (as a unit) should remain back in relationship to the back-shoulder and allow the rotation of the shoulders to advance the hands to the contact zone. 
> 
> In the torque demonstration below, note that although the bath-head accelerates, the point of bat rotation in relationship to my body remains constant. The push/pull action causes the hands to rotate about a point, but for the hands (as a unit) to move forward, I would rotate my body.  The same is true when applying THT.
> 
> <a href="http://www.batspeed.com/media/TorqueHigh.wmv">Demo - Torque applied at the handle</a>
> 
> I will cover your other questions in following posts on this thread.
> 
> Jack Mankin

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