Posted by: Scott W (stwinton@netzero.net) on Wed Apr 4 13:05:31 2007

> > > > > > > > > I play college baseball and am taught by probably one of the only instructors in america who actually knows how to teach the swing correctly...your swing mechanics are way off....I knew about 99% of coaches did not have a clue what they were talking about; but for you to post this as the most comprehensive swing analysis on the web is just terrible....rotation is probably the worst thing that can be in a swing a it forces a hitter "off line" ....i think i am going to write a book on hitting so no more nonsense can be sold to people....email me if you are interested once this happens....if it does....but trust me, reading this sort of stuff really makes me want to write one....
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > Hey Sean
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > Maybe you should enlighten the public with your mechanics as you have told us nothing. With your vast knowledge and biomechanical background can you explain 'why' it is wrong to rotate? What is 'off line'? When you answer questions you can post more.
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> > > > > > > > PS .... just means you have trouble filling in the answers.
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> > > > > > > > Dave P
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> > > > > > > 99 percent of hitters in the HALL OF FAME us these mechanics. So lets hear your analysis of that 1 percent were all waiting.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Chill, your probably right Sean...
> > > > > >
> > > > > > ?'s….If 99% of all H of F's hitters are in by using these mechanics...why, and how were they all taught with linear coaching cue's...why then does Bonds (on countless occasions!!!!!) talk about linear swing thoughts and cues? Oh ya…he’s a rotational hitter that just doesn’t know it…or he ‘thinks’ swings one way but it’s really different when you watch it in slo-mo…
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> > > > > > Here is reality; everybody is rotational, a purely linear swing in impossible however, teaching rotation (as a swing thought or key) is the surest way to guarding the Gatorade cooler on the bench. If this is such a revolutionary concept where is Jack when it comes to the ABCA convention (last winter in Orlando, next year in Philli), or any other major ‘reputable’ baseball convention…? Might that get in the way of his DVD sales to overzealous parents who are banking on buying the secret little Johnny’s future and fictional signing bonus?
> > > > >
> > > > > Hi Scott
> > > > >
> > > > > An interesting point Jack not being at the ABCA convention.
> > > > > The rest of your post is irrational and shows a lack of maturity and knowledge. With the advent of digital photography (you can get 1000 pics. per second) what elite hitters do is no lnger a mystery. Either you are blind, uninformed or hanging onto beliefs that cannot be backed up with any evidence other than opion, and everyone has one of those to go along with something else every one has.
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> > > > Irrational?
> > > >
> > > > Like I said, everybody is rotational, however, today’s 'great hitters' (ala Bonds) think about hitting a baseball with linear mental imagery...'yesterdays' great hitters did the same thing...If your contention is that all of the hall of famers use these rotational mechanics BUT, (key but) were all taught by linear hitting coaches...? Ehhh? This makes no absolutely sense? How do you explain this?
> > > >
> > > > Yet again, as I asked for a number of years ago, why are MLB hitting coaches not endorsing the revolutionary concept? Why aren’t big time college programs and college coaches jumping on this ‘revolutionary’ idea? Pick up a copy of John Cohen’s “40 hitting drills to find your best swing” DVD, he’s got testimonials, he’s got numbers, he’s got your slow-mo video, it’s the real deal…it’s not gimmicy…
> > >
> > > Hi Scott
> > >
> > > Technical change in our society has never occured at the pace it now is. Technical knowledge is doubling every 5 years. However that being said perceptions and culture change happens at a much slower rate. I will tell you a true story about a softball player that came from a small town in Nebraska, great athlete, great hand eye coordination, but didnt have great hitting power. She was recognized as being one of the elite players in the state. Her batting average was in the high 300's. She was recruited to play college softball, her college coach changed her concepts to a purely rotational swing concept. Her CAREER college batting average ended up beinng a mere .402 but more amazing her slugging percentage was .779. Im sure you have heard of Jenny Finch, in a 3 game series against her she hit 3 home runs. In a sport where pitching dominates she became one of the elite hitters because she embraced change. She is now the head coach at a division one school and is teaching rotational mechanichs. Perceptions and culture are changing slow as it may seem. There will always be protecters of tradition. When the automobile was invented there were many people that believed that this contraption would never survive and refused to learn to drive.
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> > So your response is equating Henry Ford with Jack Mankins…who’s irrational? You go on and listen to a chick softballer, I’ll stay with listening to the games leading MLB players and college coaches…agree to disagree.
> >
> > Who is more likely to know a little more about hitting, successful college coaches and MLB’ers, or a guy selling a DVD’s over the Internet who makes up his own language regarding hitting?
>
> Hi Scott
>
> To be honest with you Scott I agree with Jack but actually was taught to hit by my father who played AAA base ball I also played college ball the coaches never tried to change my swing (dont fix what aint broke) My father based his swing on Ted Williams's swing. What I am saying is that the theories that Jack promotes agree with
> perhaps baseballs most complete hitter Ted Williams. You can go ahead and stick your head in the sand and believe opinions or you can view not only slow motion recordings of the leaguses best hitters, you can also view digital photography that takes 1000 pictures per second to see what the leagues best hitters actually do not what they or some person that has a belief system that blinds their vision believes that they do. I hope you don't continue to wear the same clothes that the emperor wore when he was given something imaginary.


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-We can both look at video in super slow motion and see different things…I see Bonds getting inside, I see Bonds getting the knob in a linear vector to a spot about 10 inches inside the baseball…

Things we probably agree on…
-Everyone is rotational.
-Hand path to the baseball delivers the bat head to the ball.
-Hand path to the baseball has an arc and can be classified as rotating around the hitter body.

Things we don’t…
-The less arc/circular the hand path is in delivering the bat head to the baseball the better and the more efficient the swing will be. [With the understanding that purely linear hand path would result in making contact with the knob of the bat and not the barrel.]

-If a hitter is successful in the batting average and in power numbers because he was taught linear mechanics…whether he is linear, or rotational does it really matter?

-If a hitter believes he is being successful because his mental image and physically, his muscle memory of his swing is ‘linear’, regardless of what supper-slow-mo shows the viewer , (or the hitter for that matter) does he, and should he change his approach or mechanics?

-Name me ONE current big leaguer or big league hitting coach that can make a wholesale endorsement of this philosophy (without getting paid). If 99% of all big leaguers hit the baseball with a linear mental image, whether they actually do it or not in my opinion doesn’t really matter. In fact, some of these hitters are so freakish in the physical strength that they are, as a model the wrong models for the average hitter to attempt to emulate…in other words, they can get away with it because they are a world class athlete…

‘Rotational’ rhetoric and teaching philosophy here is basically is a straw man argument vs Linear ‘thinking.’

See the definition of straw man…
A straw man argument is a logical fallacy based on misrepresentation of an opponent's position. To "set up a straw man" or "set up a straw-man argument" is to create a position that is easy to refute, then attribute that position to the opponent.
setup of a straw man
One can set up a straw man in the following ways:
1. Present a misrepresentation of the opponent's position, refute it, and pretend that the opponent's actual position has been refuted.
2. Quote an opponent's words out of context -- i.e., choose quotations that are not representative of the opponent's actual intentions
3. Present someone who defends a position poorly as the defender, refute that person's arguments, and pretend that every upholder of that position, and thus the position itself, has been defeated.
4. Invent a fictitious persona with actions or beliefs that are criticized, and pretend that the person represents a group of whom the speaker is critical.
5. Oversimplify a person's argument into a simple analogy, which can then be attacked.