Posted by: Joe A. () on Thu Aug 9 05:50:57 2001

Can you back elbow be down to much in the swing? Should the back elbow be aligned with your shoulders?
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Mark,
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Before you start to move your hands forward your back elbow should be at your side pointing straight down. Before that it can be sticking in your ear, wait, don't try that. It can be any where as long as it moves to that position before your hands move toward the ball. Just be sure that when you bring your elbow down that you do not push it infront of your body and pointing it at your front foot or further.
> > > > > > > It must be pointing down.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Joe A.
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Mark, I think what Joe was saying is that you never want the knob of the bat in your ear. This is bad because everything has to point up. From what I know about Joe's philosophy, don't let naything get perpendicular to the body or else the bat will push in and not out.The elbow can be sideways but don't over do it.
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > >mark...i don't know if you understand those responses, i don't....down to serious business: (1) on july 25 jack posted on same subject....also at setpro.com, search archives for a thread called "a long swing.....optical illusion?".......there are pros and cons to a high elbow and quite frankly i don't think you can rely solely on what the 2 previous posters just said......respectfully, grc........
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > I see alot of hitters like Jeter Walker,Ramirez,A-rod etc hit with there back elbow aligned with there shoulder, what i am trying to ask is can having your back elbow down near your rib cage cause any problems like a long swing or a hitch?
> > > >
> > > > Mark
> > >
> > > Mark,
> > >
> > > You see many people with a stance in which they have their elbow out or up. But what you may not see is that before they start moving their hands toward the ball they drop the elbow to their side. You can't make a swing with your elbow up.
> > >
> > > Joe A.
> > > >
> >
> > >mark....are you talking about the back elbow being up/down in the STANCE, or during the STRIDE, or at LAUNCH POSITION?.........whether you use a high elbow or not, i think most people agree that by LAUNCH POSITION the back elbow should be back down........for those hitters who do use a high elbow, some may start with a high elbow in the stance....others may have it lower and then during the stride briefly elevated it to 90 degrees.......but in both cases, by the time the stride foot lands the elbow has come back down........so.....the only real issue is whether or not a high elbow is productive during the stride, and i'll refer you to the previously mentioned references (jack's post and setpro discussion)..........respectfully, grc.....
>
> Mark -
> The modern 'classic' method is to have the back elbow at 45 Deg. (half down, half up) stance/during stride/pre swing.
> Many uniformed but well meaning novice coaches teach back elbow up so that the top hand can push the bat forward. This of course is counter-productive as the hands should not push the bat.
> Back elbow pointed down in the stance is dysfunctional. It usually leads to the hands being left behind the elbows as the shoulders start to turn. THis in turn turns into a sweeping swing with the bat at the end of early-extended arms, dragging through the zone.
> If you understand Jack's concept of top hand torque, you can see a relationship between the top hand pulling back on the bat and the top hand elbow first rising (or starting high) then pulling down to the ribcage/side.
> In order to use tht the back elbow must be up to some degree in order to drop to the ribcage.
> So, the answer to your question is 'yes' you can start with the back elbow too low and it ruins a swing. Halfway between straight down and parallel to the ground is about the minimum that works. Many MLB players who use tht lift the back elbow considerably higher than that.

Mark,

I think that reason for keeping the back elbow up is that it creates maximum "cock" in the wrists.

Try this. Take a stance with your back elbow pointing to the ground. Move your wrist back and forth and you will find that there is "play" in your wrists. In other words, the wrists can be cocked back further than they are.

Now rise your back elbow parallel to the ground. Notice that your wrist can not be cocked any more. From this position, when drop your elbow to you start your swing, your wrists are in "maximum cock postion."

Joe A.