Posted by: cfs (jcsherwood8458@sbcglobal.net) on Mon Jan 11 05:57:13 2010

> >>> Jack et al:
>
> I was hoping you could clarify/verify something for me regarding the full unshrugging of the front shoulder to 105 degrees. I want to be sure I am explaining it correctly to my son.
>
> At contact, when you say the front shoulder is at 105 degrees, what is the reference point? Is it 105 degrees from the fully shrugged position? Is it 105 degrees from where the shoulder was before the batter shrugged his front shoulder? I have been empasizing the latter with my son, and he finds/feels 105 degrees is too extreme and unnatural to have his should rotated that far at contact. The good thing is that it is forcing him to open his front side at contact, and it is also promoting a fuller rotation and follow through, which lines him up better at contact. The one downside seems to be that by unshrugging that far, there is a tendency for his head to pull off the ball, and he's now hitting a lot of fouls to the right (he a right handed batter)
>
> To be more precise, if you look at the swing mechanics in the frame-by-frame cartoon on your site, I have been telling him to unshrug to the point that is shown in the frame after contact, where the lead shoulder really seems to be pushed back to the catcher. If the frame at contact shows the front shoulder at 105 degrees, then it would seem that it is 105 degrees from the shrugged position. <<<
>
> Hi Mark
>
> Many of the readers may not be familiar with the terms "shrugging" & "unshrugging" of the lead-shoulder. Below is a post from the Archives and a video clip that discusses these terms and explains why the lead-shoulder rotates about 60 more degrees than the back-shoulder.
>
> <a href="http://www.batspeed.com/messageboard/30096.html">Lead-shoulder shrugg</a>
>
> <a href="http://www.youtube.com/profile?user=MrBatSpeed#p/u/15/G0RmHnhB-VQ">Rose - Lead & Back-shoulder Rotation</a>
>
> When a batter rotates his shoulders to a point where his chest is facing the pitcher, I refer to this as the "90 degree" position. In regards to your question, the "105 degree position" means the lead-shoulder has rotated another 15 degrees rearward - back toward the catcher.
>
> Mark, I find that the vast majority of my new students are far to "back-side dominant." Meaning, they rely too much on the back-arm to bring the hands to the contact zone. Driving the top-hand forward during initiation disconnects the advancement of the hands from shoulder rotation. This disconnection results in the lead-shoulder just taking up slack rather than being productive. In most cases, once disconnection occurs, the lead-shoulder ceases to rotate past the 70 to 80 degree point - less than facing the pitcher.
>
> This is where I find the "105 degree" cue useful. I instruct my students not to use the arms (or top-hand) to advance the hands. I explain they should 'keep the hands back' and think of rotating to the "105 position" - Think, 'keep the hands back' and allow the rotation of my shoulders to rotate my hands around to contact. I reinforce this by standing behind them and holding the bat as they initiate their swing. -- I ask, do you feel your arms pulling your hands, or, the rotation of your shoulders?
>
> Another important reason we want the lead-shoulder to be pulling rearward (105 position) at contact is its effect on generating bat speed. Understanding the importance of obtaining this position might better be explained by plotting the trajectory of the lead-elbow it produces. As the lead-shoulder rotates rearward toward the 105 position, it pulls the lead-elbow rearward. My plotting of lead-elbow trajectories show that hitters that produce greater power and bat speed exhibit greater rearward pull than hitters with less power.
>
> <a href="http://www.batspeed.com/media/BHT_ Good_vs_Poor.wmv">Good & Bad - BHT</a>
>
> <a href="http://www.batspeed.com/media/Burrell_Bonds_BHT.wmv">Burrell & Bonds - BHT Mechanics</a>
>
> I know we just showed the "No Hook" video clip in a discussion below. However, it exemplifies the back-side dominant mechanics I refer to in this discussion. Note how little his shoulders rotate (from lag to contact) once his swing become disconnected during initiation.
>
> <a href="http://www.youtube.com/profile?user=MrBatSpeed#p/u/2/_C2qF8d-BAI">No Hook</a>
>
> Jack Mankin

Hi Jack,

I was happy to read in your post how you stand near the hitter and hold the bat while the hitter applies force. I have used the same approach with my son recently for THT. I stood in front of him, held the bat, and had him pull back with his top hand. It really helped him identify and isolate the muscles that need to be used and the forces that need to be applied. It helped him to differentiate between pulling back with the top hand versus simply lowering the back elbow. This is much harder to do while the swing is in motion. The results are clear after just a couple of sessions and we will continue to reinforce this during practice sessions. We are going to try this method for other aspects of the swing (BHT) as well. Your posting confirms that our approach is on track.

Thanks,
cfs