Posted by: ray porco () on Wed Jul 11 20:50:57 2001

Q: “ what do you mean by: "...bat is shoulder height..." do you mean the entire bat or just a part, such as the barrel?”
>
> A: it is my educated guess that huggens was referring to a hitter in the position of bonds, p116, frame 25 or caminiti, p 199, frame 111...
>
> Q: "...knob is even with back and not front hip..." from what view? “
>
> A: the side view
> Q: “ with the entire hip area, or maybe just where the socket would be located?
> also, remember hips are turning as the knob is changing location. on hitting an outside pitch the hips don't open as much as trying to pull the ball. further, some hitters open their hips far ealier than others. mcguire likes to get his hips out of the way so that he can make more use of his upper body. griffey has less lag time. not that mcquire doesn't use his hips - just differently. for those reasons, referencing the knob of the bat to the "hip" is difficult.
> i think referencing to the feet (which don't move nearly as much as the hips just before and after heel plant)allows for better comparisons”
>
> A: i agree the front/back feet are easier reference points to describe......i used hips as a reference point only because huggens did......but i maintain that if the hands are halfway between the front/back foot, the hands are also half way between the front/back hip...it’s just that using feet as reference points is easier to use than hips.....again, i used hips as a reference point only because huggens did......
>
> Q: : "...bathead has already been released..." i don't think you mean the moment the bathead starts toward the ball, but what point in the swing do you consider the bathead being released?
> thinking of the bathead's path as resembling the nike "swoosh", at what point along the path do you consider it being "released"?”
>
> A: i recognize that opinions may vary as to the moment in time the bathead is “released”....i choose this particular moment in time (“lag position”) for several reasons.........(1) after the stride has been completed it is the half-way point in the swing because (A) visually it looks like the halfway point and (B) it is the point where Adair (the physics of baseball) says most of the energy in the swing has been generated and the bat is in a reaction mode..............(2) the lag position is easy to visualize and describe........(3) the lag position is the point where the hands have reached their maximum radius from the body ( a mathematician might have a better description than “maximum radius”).........the lag position is where the elbow first enters “the slot”............. (4) in my opinion, it’s from the lag position that the bathead is ready to be more precisely directed to the target..............................understand that i am not suggesting that bathead release is linked with commitment of hands, etc......and if there is a better term to use than “bathead release” I’ll use it....
>
> Q: “ would you like me to ask hudgens what he really meant? not being smart but, what's preventing you? "...major leaguers release bathead halfway between front and back hip..."
> i kinda, sorta, maybe get it. and if it's what i think i think you think, then i agree. could you maybe clear it up for me? or am i splitting hairs again?”
>
> A: (1) i can’t ask huggens questions because I’m not a customer and his forum is now for customers only...............(2) when the forum was open to non-customers, huggens did not like to be challenged or second-guessed......if he did answer questions, usually it would not be a direct answer to a direct question.......and sometimes he would delete posts that he didn’t agree with..........................but if you have a way of asking dave the question, i would love to hear his answer.....................respectfully, grc............


grc,

sorry for the late response. again, very good answer/s. two things i know about you for sure:
1. your disdain for "the fence drill"
2. "lag position" rules

your definition of lag position was clear. in fact, it made me look at something i had never thought of before.
your quote, "...the lag position is where the elbow first enters 'the slot'..."
this has started me looking at the position of the elbow relative to the head when the bat is at a 45 degree angle. it may be nothing, but i have decided to dig out some video and have a look.

other things i'm lookin' at now:

stride AND swing vs. stride THEN swing. recent thread here started me thinking. actually i think it is stride TO swing.

that friggin' body tilt by a.rod and aaron.

lastly - balance. not quite prepared to come up with any conclusions, at least publicly, on what i'm currently looking at. it may be nothing at all. i don't want to be accused of (as Paul would say) "thought experiments". will need more observations.

thanks for reply.
ray porco