Posted by: tom.guerry (tom.guerry@kp.org) on Sun Mar 25 15:26:56 2001

I was very lucky to find this site, I have been coaching for 12 years and was always questioning the methods being taught. Living in Knoxville, TN, our teams played a lot in Chattanooga, TN. While there with my 12 year olds, I met Ralph Weekly, he saw our girls hitting and he asked if I would work in a few of his gold Medal hitting camps. For those baseball people, and others, Weekly was the hitting coach for the 1996 Softball Olympic team. He has many tapes out, and many consider him the last word in softball hitting. Now, here is the kicker, I have an undergraduate degree in Physics, and graduate degree in Mechanical Engineering, and something has always bothered me about all of the tapes and what was being taught.
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> > > I purchased Jack's tape and within 5 minutes, it all made sense after all these years. I now know why my instincts kept telling me something was wrong.
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> > > I have sent Jack a tape of my daughter Mary swinging at various views. I just received an email that the analysis was finished. I am the only hitting coach she has had, so I will accept all blame for the many flaws I am sure he will find.
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> > > A couple of things I have discovered about females and hitting, one is that a fairly early age they need to start lifting, especially upper body, it has made a tremendous difference in Mary's Swing and confidence. I am very fortunate to live where I do, Mary started working out with the Lady Vols basketball team when she was 13, and at 14 her bat speed was measured at 88 MPH (dry swings), which I really don't put much stock in, just a reference point. The other really mice thing is that Todd Helton a Knoxville native, and University of Tennessee baseball and football player (now a Rocky) works out here in the Winter at the indoor practice facility we built. So he and Mary had several hitting challenges during the Winter. He smoked her!!! But, I paid close attention to his swing and after watching Jacks tapes, he gets a tremendous amount of top hand torque, but he doesn't know how he hits so well. He says he has just always been a good hitter and never analyzed his swing. He did say his hitting coach watches him closely, but in looking back and talking to his hitting coach one day while he was in town, I now realize the professional hitting coach doesn't get it, he just has a lot of talent to work with.
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> > > I apologize for writing such a long post, it is my first and I thought a few might be interested in some of my experiences.
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> > > Oh, my only real difference with Jack, is that girls have a real hard time of continuing their swing after contact, so hitting a stationary bag might be bad, I believe it just reinforces the bad habits. I think a heavy hitting tube, that you can 'drive' through might be better. Thanks for listening and I hope I didn't offend anyone.
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> > > Dave Roberts -It is nice to hear a father that is as concerned,dedicated and proud of his daughters accomplishments ,ability and drive to excell as you are Dave.She sounds like a fantastic athlete.I along with many others who visit this site can identify with your enthusiasm and pride because we are also the proud parents and coaches of some wonderful ball players.Whatever adjustments Mr.Mankin advises with your daughters swing will be put in the most positive terms that it really won't seem like a correction,just solid,friendly advise from someone you both know and trust.As to hitting the heavy bag,I hope that you will consider some of the benifits this drillhas to offer.You can see the position of your daughters arms,hips,shoulders and legs when contact is made.It also lets her know thatall the batspeed that has any relavance to the swing is that which is developed prior to contact.Since the ball is in contact with the bat for such a short period of time.the follow through is not as critical as many of uswere led to beleive.I am sure Mr. Mankin will more thoroughly answer your concerns shortly .Keep up the good work with your daughter and let people on this site know about your continued progress.Thanks
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> Dave,
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> I enjoyed your post. Your very correct girls do need strengthening (most). And if you follow Weekly you might need lots of strength.
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> Interesting about Helton. I would guess the Rockies coach must be a good coach. I've seen too many hitter thrive under his tollage. What type of transfer mechanics did he suggest or talk about, same as the average? and anything out of the ordinary on the lower body?
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> My quick analysis on Hellion, smooth. He wouldn't know if he was apply top hand torque, or just trusting the hands. Hitters do it differently as defined by Mankin's description of bottom/top hand torque, some are either/or, some have the ability to do both well. I believe Helton drags the back/elbow down/forward and is very smooth at initiation. Compared to applying/pull the bat back toward the catcher.
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> Nice post, I have only looked at him a few times and will look closer now.
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> Shawn

Dave-

I also enjoyed your post.I agree with you and Shawn that you have to deal with the strength deficit early on with girls.Any more specifics about what works?

You might also be interested in the hitting forum on the Fastpitch Forum where I have been perceived as stirring up trouble for quite some time by recommending Jack's ideas and mentioning caveats about the orthodox fastpitch approach of Weekly,Candrea,etc.

Lau Jr. has a brief interesting chapter on fastpitch and past discussions are available on setpro about the "fastpitch" vs baseball(Jack type)swing.Are you familiar with any of these?

The major problem in fastpitch is that everyone thinks you have to be in such a rush to swing. Kids end up swinging while striding(no stationary axis)and almost invariably lack what Jack terms"tight connection",so as soon as the torso turns,the hands are left behind causing premature extension(no circular handpath).Being in such a rush does indeed cause "rushing" so that the linear handpath sucks energy out of the torso before the lower body can energize the torso.Then you have an armpowered swing depending mainly on hands applying torque late in the swing as described by Jack in his tape.

Instead of using Jack's principles-stationary axis/circular handpath/torque throughout swing you get the moving axis,linear handoath and torque at the end from wrist snap.This gives the a lowbatspeed swing with early extension and wrist wrist roll(Weekly recommends having the palms facing front back at contact which few of his power hitters actually do).It is these flaws that create the early cutoff of the swing.Hitting the heavy bag will not encourage this as mentioned above if you use the right mechanics as described by Jack.