Posted by: Shawn () on Sun Aug 8 12:53:12 2004

>>> You all keep talking about tht as if you think you know what it is. But I defy 5 different people to briefly define YOUR definition of tht, and I am willing to bet you will get 5 different answers.Sure, you can cop out by saying "reaearch the site" or "buy the dvd", but can ANYONE really articulate what tht means to them? I DON'T THINK SO! <<<
> > > > >
> > > > > Hi Tony
> > > > >
> > > > > Welcome to the site. I will give you as quick and concise definition as I possibly can. -- During initiation, THT applies a force at the handle that assists shoulder rotation in accelerating the bat-head in the swing plane (back toward the catcher). --- Hitters like Bonds, Sosa and etc., use THT during pre-launch (before shoulder rotation and the lowering of the elbow to the slot). The acceleration of the bat-head is supplied from the pulling back of the top-hand by the adduction of the arm and shoulder complex (no shoulder rotation involved).
> > > > >
> > > > > Jack Mankin
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Jack,
> > > >
> > > > are u saying THT is applied BEFORE hip and shoulder rotation, maybe following the inward turn where the hands move back to the shoulder, or should we apply THT when rotation begins? Because I've been applying THT simulatneously with my hip rotation, and I seem to be dropping the back shoulder and hitting pop-ups. any solution?
> > > >
> > > > Steve
> > > > >
> > >
> > > tony, i recently made these comments......
> > >
> > > jack,the concept of tht has repeatedly come under attack and it's your own fault for not clearly articulating what it is and what it is not...
> > >
> > > it is NOT a direct source of power...
> > >
> > > it IS one of several steps in proper positioning of the hips, hands and bat....
> > >
> > > the knob-to-the-pitcher thing is simply ("simply" but important) a technique (along with other techniques) to facilitate the hands getting started in a circular path, as well as giving the hips a headstart ahead of the hands...
> > >
> >
> > I dont understand why everyone has such a difficult time understanding top hand torque. If you understand what torque is and you look at a clip of Sosa and think "well let me see if I can find the top hand applying torque to the bat" it is very clear. Sammy does start applying top hand torque before he initiates shoulder rotation as can be seen in numerous clips. It is the same for Bonds too. I like the clip of Bonds from behind his back shoulder that shows his hands from the Youth Baseball Coaching site the best. It shows all the pre-launch movements and THT along with Bonds' perfect CHP and "hook" in the hand path.
> >
> > grc- how is it not a direct source of power? If you are using your top hand and forearm muscles to accelerate the bat then you are clearly generating a direct source of batspeed (assuming you believe batspeed allows a person to hit for power).
> >
> > I sent Jack my tape for review and he mentioned to me that I wasn't applying Top Hand Torque and my bat was not in motion before shoulder rotation. He showed me a clip of Sammy in the home run derby and described what it is and it became very simple and easy to understand. I worked hard and started to apply top hand torque before shoulder rotation and hit my first home run of my life (oppo) this year and also hit a ball over 300ft with wood off of a change up. Not bad for weighing 145 at the time. I of course still havn't perfected it but I know its there from video clips and the jump in power.
>
> Hi,
>
> THT torque is easy to understand. I just believe rotation has a bigger role in getting things started. Every swing I look at I can see when rotation begins and the acceleration of bathead begins.
>
> I can't say it better then Jack so here it is,
>
> "You are correct, starting the swing with "The back elbow up" is on almost every coach's "Bad Advice" list. --- Initiating the swing with the rear elbow down may constitute the right mechanics for the weight-shift and extension swing model, however, in that model, as the batter initiates the swing, the direction of force of the top hand is directed toward the pitcher. Having the elbow already down places the arm in a good driving position for these mechanics.
>
> Having the elbow lowered to the batter’s side is not as powerful a position for the rotational hitter. With the rotational transfer mechanics, as the batter initiates the swing, he does not push the top hand toward the pitcher. He instead pulls with the fingers of the top hand back toward the catcher (THT) to first accelerate the bat-head in an arc back toward the catcher (ala Pujols or Bonds or Sosa, or etc). Therefore, this style of mechanics would want the elbow in a more elevated position -- in-line with the intended direction of pull -- like an archer’s elbow as he pulls back the bowstring. With the elbow flat down at the side, he would not be in as powerful a position to pull the top-hand back at initiation. "
>
> Simple to understand.
>
> Shawn
>
>

Hi,

One more thing, as I work on my swing I can tell when THT is applied. All we are doing is working with the natural rotation of the swing. I can't say how much is applied prior to rotation in my swing because I tend to cock the hand and back elbow moreso. I can tell when something extra is applied as the swing is much smoother and faster.

I didn't always believe Jack's theories. But, after trying to match ML'ers swing frame for frame I'm becoming a believer of his logic.

Shawn