Posted by: Matt () on Sat Apr 24 11:19:42 2004

I don't believe Doug said good hitters become good instructors. I believe he said good hitters figured it out in the batters box not on paper.
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> > > > > I hope you understand the difference.
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> > > > > And, I hope you understand that a cue to one player means something completely different to another. A player who is doing most everything correctly can benefit from a cue that a player who is just beginning can't.
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> > > > > To suggest that being instructed is more valuable than time in the box is ridiculous. They are both important.
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> > > > > "Hands to the ball" is a frequent cue and one that is taboo here. Yet, hands to the ball is not a problem when done correctly. Jack hears that and thinks linear immediately. However, I can rotate my hands to the ball with no linear component.
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> > > > > So, although I believe instruction can shorten the learning process, all instruction is for naught without 100's of hours swinging and taking bp.
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> > > > > And, nothing is worse than coaches who haven't taken the swings dishing out the information like a lemming. They have a picture that they try to explain but they don't understand cause and effect and they don't understand which muscle groups are actually working to produce the required movement.
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> > > > > And, for this post to come from Brian and not Jack or John leaves me wondering.
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> > > > Teacherman,
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> > > > I hope that you understand what "reoccurring theme" means. It means that many people have suggested that you had to have played at a high level in order to properly teach batting mechanics.
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> > > > If you want to believe that the linear cues are productive, then then by all means use them. However, history has shown that the linear cues were not productive. The rise in batting statistics occurred in the 1990s with the understanding that the best hitters were not actually using the linear cues that were being taught. In my opinion, there is be little disagreement as to what "keep your shoulder in there" means or "A to B," though there may be room for disagreement on other cues.
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> > > > We agree that 1000s of hours practicing the swing in the cage are necessary. However, 1000s of hours practicing improper swing mechanics will lead to a good high school or college player and not much more. Therefore, it is important to practice proper mechanics.
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> > > > I'm not sure if you are suggesting that Jack Mankin has never played the game and is only teaching based on video analysis, but if so, that is totally incorrect.
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> > > > And this post did come solely from Brian. I am not Jack and I'm not John Elliot. However, I have studied swing mechanics for years with Jack. I posted this thread because I think it is a good topic that is often brought up to diminish the credibility of Jack and others who have not played professional ball (and Jack probably has no interest in rehashing it again), so why not discuss it.
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> > > > Brian
> > > > BatSpeed.com
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> > > Doesn't surprise me that you would cloud the issue by saying linear cues are unproductive.
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> > > Don't ask how you rotate the hands to the ball! Don't ask for clarification if you're unsure! Just assume any cue that batspeed doesn't like is linear. Go ahead an bury YOUR head in the sand just like others here and simply dead end a discussion when the obvious answers to tough questions don't fit your hitting mold.
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> > > Are you really interested in the truth? Or has it turned to let's protect our philosophy?
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> > > Speaking of though questions I would like Batspeeds answer to Mr. Nyman's question......Why are 95%+ of the major league players rotational while most all the coaching is linear?????????????
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> > Teacherman,
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> > It doesn't surprise me that instead of discussing and analyzing the linear cues that you evidently encourage that you would accuse me of clouding the issues and burying my head in the sand. If we are going to be frank, the only one burying their head in the sand is you and your continuing inability discuss the issues, including in this case whether linear cues are useful or unproductive. For once, it would be nice if you tried to enlighten the subject and explain your position, such as with respect to the following traditional linear cues: "keep your shoulder in there," "get your arms extended," "quick hands," "A to B," and "swing down at the ball." For instance, what "clarification" should the 14-year-old hitter request from his coach after hearing these cues? What analysis should the 14-year-old hitter engage in when his coach instructs him to apply cues? Explain how a 14-year-old hitter going to apply these cues differently from what his coach is obviously telling him to do? I would be very interested in hearing how these linear cues will lead to a hitter applying productive rotational batting mechanics, as compared to linear mechanics.
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> > Obviously, whenever someone posts a cue on the discussion board, we can request "clarification" and play this back and forth game, but that is not practical for the ball player who is attempting to follow the advice of his coach. The whole point of a cue is to prompt ACTION, not seek "clarification."
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> > For your edification, "cue" means:
> >
> > - A signal, such as a word or action, used to prompt another event in a performance.
> > - A reminder or prompting.
> > - A hint or suggestion.
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> > Thus, the whole point of a cue is to prompt immediate, specific action, not to expect a young player to commence a discussion with his coach regarding the basis and application of the cue. If that were the norm, then it would certainly “cloud the issue.” If your goal is to find the truth, then I suggest that you take a close, objective look at the cues and determine how the normal ballplayer will interpret them. Isn't that the whole goal....to teach cues that encourage batters to use proper mechanics so that they can become better hitters?
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> > In the event that you believe BatSpeed.com is wrong about one of the linear cues noted above, meaning that the cue would actually assist the batter and improve his mechanics, then state your position. If anyone has a new or different cue that they believe would be helpful, then lets discuss it. IMO, I would much prefer that discussion, as compared to arguing about who seeks the truth or has their head buried, which is the easy, non-analytical approach.
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> > Brian
> > BatSpeed.com
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> Excuse me but I thought that concepts that people like Teacherman preach (knob to the ball, fence drill, keep the shoulder turned in, etc)were discredited years ago.It would seem to me that since Jack has publicized his studies with the backing of a physics professor, produce a tape and a dvd, and let us discuss the matter for the last 3 or 4 years, why would ANYONE still subscribe to this stuff? Teacherman, please don't take this personally, because I know that you sometimes have a tendency to be a bit sensitive but you need to understand something: linear hitting is a thing of the past. With video analysis, slo mo, etc available today, there are a lot of theories, including linear hitting from yesteryear that have been debunked. And Jack has been a pioneer in his field.
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Teacherman he's right. Believe me, the night I read the material at this site I was skeptical too. But my son hadn't been doing so good so the next day we practiced what I learned at this site and never looked back.I don't know your personal situation, whether you are yourself a hitter or if you have a son or daughter, but I'll give some advice that may or may not apply to you, but it surely will applay to some people out there.The advice is this: generally those who may be struggling are the most willing to try something new, and those who feel they are already a success (or think they already have all the answers) are the most reluctant to venture out of their shell. Of course, this is human nature, you know, the "if it ain't broke, don't fix it" thing. But my advice is to not feel that you are such a success that you are afraid to try something new to you, because no matter how good you are, someone else out there is better than you are, i.e., there is ALWAYS room for improvement! The sooner you get away from the linear stuff the better you will be. Good luck to you !