Posted by: JJA (jjanagnost@worldnet.att.net) on Fri Jan 30 08:18:44 2004

THT and the x-factor are related in the terms that with THT the hands do not move forward which delays shoulder rotation while the hips continue to rotate. This creates more x-factor stretch and when the hands start coming forward the shoulders and torso rotate faster to catch up to the hips. Even though they do not appear related the actions of THT benefit and ultimately help to maximize the x-factor stretch. There is x-factor stretch in almost every type of swing, whether good, bad or ugly, but to maximize it so that maximum bat head speed is achieved is what we should be looking for and THT is a contibuting factor to maximal x-factor stretch.
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> Dave

Hi,

Thank you for your interesting reply. I can't say that I completely agree, based on the definition of THT as given by Jack. As Jack describes it, the THT is really a movement of hands backward toward the catcher to generate bat speed. Here is a quote of his from his famous post on THT (in reference to Brett's swing):

"It showed George pulling his top hand back toward the catcher BEFORE HE STARTED HIS ROTATION". (Caps are mine.)

In other words the hands are moving BEFORE rotation. In particular, nowhere in his posts nor in his video does he talk about the importance of starting the hips rotating before or while applying THT which would be more akin to X-factor stretch. I do agree with most everything you say, but precisely speaking it is not the definition of THT as given by Jack and I believe is signicantly different from his definition.

I'll have to look carefully at the tape of big leaguers, but I can definitely say that X-factor stretch is not common in "bad, or ugly" golf swings, only the "good" ones. A very common golf swing flaw among amateurs at the top of the swing is to start the swing with the hands, casting them outside the target line to produce a slice. The proper move of course is to start slightly with the hips that produce the X-factor stretch before starting the hands and shoulders.

Why I like this thread is a question that has been puzzling me since learning about THT. There is nothing akin to THT in golf. The golf demonstration of THT that Jack gives on his video is never done in golf among professionals. Casting at the top of the swing does create early "clubhead speed", but at the loss of the wrists breaking way too early and subsequent huge loss of power. Why THT works for baseball and not for golf is almost certainly related to the significantly different swing planes between golf and baseball, but I haven't worked it all out yet.

Thanks again for your interesting reply.

-JJA