Posted by: Mister X () on Thu Jun 19 16:52:46 2003

>>> I fixed a problem in my swing last year- I wasn't turning my hips hardly at all. A coach told me to "squash the bug", so I started to turn (more). When I found this site., I started to think I might be turning them too late.
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> > > > From watching the frame-by-frame swing on the "mechanics" pages, it looks to me like the hips are all the way open by frame #C. Isn't that early, compared to the text about ?
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> > > > Another post deep in the archives says the hips should lead the shoulders by about 30 degrees; you don't want to have that three-stage, stride-then-hips-then-shoulders segmented thing going on. But sure looks to me like this sketch guy has more than 30 degrees going on between his hips and shoulders.
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> > > > I ask because I want to know- how do I know the proper time to open the hips? I think I had been doing it too late (so I'd end up finishing in about the right position, if a bit McGriff-helicopter-swing-ish), but now I'm worried I'm doing it too early, and I'll pop everything weakly to right that I don't miss completely. How would I know if I do it too soon? <<<
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> > > > Hi Mike
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> > > > Welcome to the site. --- Most clips show the batter as viewed from over the pitchers right shoulder or from across the plate. I choose to view the swing from some where in-between. The clip traced on Swing Mechanics was shot more from a 45 degree angle or from above the area where the first baseman plays. Therefore, from this viewpoint, the hips appear more open. But I think that if you look at how far the belt loops rotate from Frame #B to #C you will see a rotation of the hips to be about 20 to 30 degrees as the lead heel plants and the hips start to open. And from that point, the shoulders rotate in unison with the hips.
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> > > > Mike, when working on your swing mechanics it is more important to note when the shoulders rotate than when the hips open. There is no direct connection of the hips to the bat. It is the rotation of the shoulders that supply the power for the swing through the arms to the bat. The importance of hip rotation in the swing is in how much it contributes to shoulder rotation. Position of the shoulders at launch and then at contact is more important than hip position.
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> > > > Jack Mankin
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> > > I think I agree but disagree. And I think you contradicted yourself, but I'm not sure.
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> > > I believe the hips have a VERY important connection/effect on the bat and batspeed. They supply much of the power in the swing. Yes that energy is transfered through the shoulder rotation to the bat. But it comes from the hips. If you don't rotate your hips you won't swing as quick/fast/hard as you would if you do rotate your hips. That's a given. So how can the hips have to direct connection/effect on the bat.
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> > > But then later you say exactly that. "The importance of hip rotation in the swing is in how much it contributes to shoulder rotation". So didn't you just contradict yourself? If the hips have no direct connection to the bat, it shouldn't matter what they do. But you just said that they contribute to shoulder rotation. The hips contribute to shoulder rotation and shoulder rotation brings the bat to the zone (swings the bat). Am I correct there or not? If I am correct, then the hips DO have a very important connection to the bat.
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> > The Golf swing has been studied far greater than the baseball swing. I suggest to anyone read Ben Hogan's Five Lessons : The Modern Fundamentals of Golf. Easily the greatest golf instructional book of all time. He writes extensively about the role of the hips, shoulders, arms and hands in hitting from the inside with maximum power. Hogan wrote that if one leads with the hips, the hands and shoulders stay back, one builds up tension like a spring between the hips and the shoulders. This tension creates an enormous store house of power to be unleashed on the ball. Furthermore by leading with the hips the player is forced to hit from the inside. My real life little league experience this season agrees with this. At some point I will post the amazing success story.
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> I have coached baseball at the most senior levels including college and I have to respectfully disagree with the idea that there is much, if anything to learn from golf that you can apply to hitting a baseball. Try, for example telling a golfer to keep his elbow in the slot, or to take a stride!



The stride is not part of the baseball swing either. It is part of the pre-swing, and only helps in timing and breaking inertia.

And you don't think golfers keep their elbows in the slot??? Where does their elbow go then? Maybe they don't use the same terms, but it is basically the same swing.